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On a rainy morning in Munich, I sat down with two of the biggest names in the opera panorama today, both in town performing in the Bavarian State Opera\u2019s production of Don Carlo. Tenor\u00a0Jonas Kaufmann<\/strong>\u00a0and bass\u00a0Ren\u00e9 Pape<\/strong>\u00a0arrived with German punctuality looking fresh and very relaxed in jeans despite a grueling 4 1\/2 hour-long performance just the night before. In this industry where the top voices are all too often accompanied by foul personalities, diva-esque behavior and eccentricities, Kaufmann and Pape are surprisingly down to earth for their level of fame. With these two, there are no egos and no airs. They are also the biggest goofballs. Jonas, an engaging conversationalist who loves to laugh, is easy to talk to and answers questions with great enthusiasm and eloquence. Unlike some singers who I call \u201cjock-pera singers\u201d (beautiful voices, dumb as a jock), Jonas is an intelligent artist who possess a deep, comprehensive understanding of the many other elements that feed into the\u00a0Gesamtkunstwerk<\/em>\u00a0that is opera including history, literature, politics, etc. He also speaks French, English, and Italian with great proficiency. He attributes his knack for languages to his foundations in ancient Greek and Latin which he studied as a youth at his Gymnasium in Munich. Pape, tall and strikingly handsome with an old-world elegance about him, is really a comic in disguise. Though he comes off as taciturn and pensive, he injects his dry sense of humor from time to time, catching both Jonas and me off guard and sending us into bouts of laughter. Together, the German duo makes a terrific team: their combined artistry on stage sells out every single performance while their off-stage charisma and camaraderie is priceless and endearing. This week they appear in Richard Wagner\u2019s Lohengrin, Kaufmann in the lead role and Pape as King Heinrich, which opens Teatro alla Scala\u2019s 2012-2013 season celebrating the dual bicentennial of the births of composers Giuseppe Verdi and Richard Wagner.<\/p>\n I\u2019d like start with a topic other than opera. We already know you two can sing.\u00a0 Let\u2019s talk about fashion and menswear. How would you describe your personal style? I know that Ren\u00e9, for instance, likes to accent his look with splashes of bright colors.\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong> And Jonas, you\u2019re always very well put together. What is your relationship with fashion?\u00a0<\/strong> From?\u00a0<\/strong> How would you describe your day to day style? Are you more of a blazer, sport coat kind of guy or do you prefer jeans and a T-shirt?\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong> You get beat up by Ren\u00e9! I saw him throwing you across the stage.\u00a0<\/strong> From him?!<\/strong>\u00a0(pointing at Ren\u00e9)\u00a0\u00a0<\/em> He\u2019s such a bully, this guy!<\/strong>\u00a0(Ren\u00e9 mumbles something inaudible in German. Laughter<\/em>)\u00a0Okay, and Ren\u00e9?\u00a0<\/strong> Do you have a favorite tailor?\u00a0<\/strong> But you\u2019re still not afraid to wear splashes of color.\u00a0\u00a0<\/strong> Wait, I need a picture of those socks! They are so cool.\u00a0<\/strong> Ha, perfect, you just answered one of my other questions which is: \u201cWhat would you do if you weren\u2019t an opera singer?\u201d\u00a0<\/strong> Why?\u00a0<\/strong> Oh, come on! That\u2019s not what you really think, is it?\u00a0<\/strong> So then you don\u2019t really want to throw your mirror away if it\u2019s your friend.\u00a0<\/strong> Jonas, do you have any superstitions or rituals you always perform before going on stage?\u00a0<\/strong> Ok, here is a very important question for both of you. Do opera singers snore louder than the average person? \u00a0Do you employ your operatic technique while you are sleeping?\u00a0<\/strong> You don\u2019t snore? Really?!\u00a0<\/strong> In your opinion, which country or city has the most discerning audience? I noticed here in Munich the audience is very gracious, staying long after the performance for countless curtain calls. The applause just went on and on last night, but obviously they recognized it was a world class performance. I\u2019ve been at other venues where the audience didn\u2019t have a clue and would give standing ovations and shout \u201cBravo!\u201d for even very mediocre performances.\u00a0<\/strong> Ren\u00e9, what is your proudest moment in life thus far and what do you hope to accomplish in the next five years?\u00a0<\/strong>
\nJK: There, there! (pointing at Ren\u00e9\u2019s bright red socks<\/em>) It\u2019s always there, the spots of color.<\/p>\n
\nJK: For me the story if very simple. I\u2019ve been connected with a fashion label for many years, which makes dressing much easier. Now I\u2019ve stopped shopping and looking for the newest items since I\u2019ve got an endless supply of fashion.<\/p>\n
\nJK: It\u2019s a German tailor who is more popular for women\u2019s clothes than menswear. Women\u2019s fashion is worldwide and menswear is only in selected countries. I like it very much.<\/p>\n
\nJK: Well, you see when I started out and had my first engagements, I came just the way I always walked around \u2013 very sportive, only with jeans and sneakers. And then, I think it was somewhere in Italy, I found this amazing shirt tailor and they had all these brilliant colors, and I love color! So I bought a huge selection of shirts there and I wore them to rehearsals everyday because I was proud of my new shirt collection; every day a new shirt. And in this production, I tell you, the director treated me as if I were two classes higher. Suddenly, you show up not just like a youngster with broken jeans and chewing gum. I thought: it\u2019s not about your singing quality, it\u2019s not what you\u2019re doing on stage and your acting, it\u2019s more about the way you are dressed. All of a sudden [the people I worked with] were much more respectful than before. So from that moment on I dressed more formal and it worked very well. Now I can go back to jeans and sneakers, because obviously, if you have a suit you can\u2019t kneel down and roll on the floor!<\/p>\n
\nJK: Yes, I ripped my jeans and got a huge hole in one of my sweaters during rehearsals.<\/p>\n
\nJK: It\u2019s always him, of course! I mean\u2026 just look at him!<\/p>\n
\nRP: I\u2019m coming from the other side of The Wall (East Germany) and had nothing growing up. I never had money, I never had access to nice things. So when I finished my studies and became a member of the Berlin Opera House, I got all of a sudden a pay raise from two hundred East German mark of study fee to five thousand \u2013 the same pay as a chief doctor. It was a huge jump. And then I went crazy \u2013 I wanted this, and this, and that. I was looking in the magazines and wanted to buy everything. So I became a fashion maniac for many years. Then I realized my closet was going to explode so therefore I stopped buying things and now I\u2019m wearing things I bought ten years ago because they are still brand new and have never been worn. Like shoes. I have millions of shoes, some I\u2019ve only worn once and then they are still fresh.
\nJK: And they don\u2019t even smell after ten years.
\nRP: There was a time I was going to rehearsals in a nice jacket or blazer, but dressing that way made me hesitant to get down and dirty, like rolling on the floor. I was rehearsing in a different way. So now, I wear sneakers and dress much more casually for rehearsals and it\u2019s good because I can move and be much more comfortable without being afraid of destroying my clothes.<\/p>\n
\nJK: He has this fantastic coat, for instance, from a tailor in Dresden.
\nRP: Yeah, I\u00a0have a good tailor in Dresden who is actually from Italy. I was completely addicted to Etro and bought all the shirts I could find. It didn\u2019t matter if they fit me or not, I just had to have them! And now that I\u2019m getting older, I\u2019m more Ralph Lauren Purple or Black Label.<\/p>\n
\nRP: No, not at all.<\/p>\n
\nJK: They\u2019re pac-man!
\nRP: I\u2019m from East Germany; that means I have to wear red socks!
\nJK: Hahaha, rote Socken!
\nRP: I am a fashionista. I am a total fashion addict! I would love to open my own fashion label and I would also perhaps like to be an interior designer if I had the time.<\/p>\n
\nRP: I would definitely be a designer.
\nAZ: Ren\u00e9, what do you think when you look at yourself in the mirror?
\nRP: The first thing I think is that I should buy a new mirror.<\/p>\n
\nRP: The mirror is never as good as I am, so gotta buy a new one.<\/p>\n
\nRP:\u00a0 I see imperfections just like anyone else \u2013 there\u2019s a little spot there and and dark puffy circles under my eyes, and you should take care of yourself a little bit more. The mirror always tells you the truth. When you get up in the morning or you look at in the mirror in the afternoon or at night, it\u2019s always your double. Years ago I was very much like \u2013 okay this mirror tells me I have to change. But now I consider the mirror my friend. It\u2019s the guy who always goes with me telling me: \u201cokay Ren\u00e9, take care a little bit more,\u201d or \u201coh, Ren\u00e9, you were great tonight!\u201d or \u201cRen\u00e9, you really screwed up tonight, but take your sleep and come back and let\u2019s talk again tomorrow.\u201d<\/p>\n
\nRP: No, of course not. The mirror is\u00a0your<\/em><\/strong>\u00a0mirror, and everybody needs his mirror.<\/p>\n
\nJP: No. I do some yoga before, that\u2019s the only thing that I do regularly. If it\u2019s a very demanding role, I may have a nap in the afternoon. Sometimes I may even warm up in the late morning, around 11am, just to have the voice already prepared. But this is not a ritual \u2013 I only do it sometimes. If there is something like a ritual, I\u2019m always late for the performance. Well, not really that late where I can\u2019t make it on stage in time, but I\u2019m always much later than most of my colleagues. I know singers who arrive at the theater three or four hours before to warm up and read or sing through the entire part. Last night, for instance [before Don Carlo], I came 35 minutes before the beginning and I\u2019m the first on stage, but for me it\u2019s just the time I need. The performance prior to that, I arrived 45 minutes before the because I had two TV interviews to do. After that I went into the makeup room and disturbed my dear colleague. (pointing to Ren\u00e9<\/em>)
\nRP: No, no, I disturb you!
\nJP: That was funny. The camera team followed me into the makeup room and then they didn\u2019t want to let him in and he was like (imitating Ren\u00e9\u2019s deep voice<\/em>): \u201cWait a minute, I don\u2019t care about interviews, I need my makeup now!!! Just let me in!!\u201d
\nRP: Hey, I didn\u2019t do it that way! (Imitating Jonas\u2019 grumpy imitation of him<\/em>) I said, \u201cI don\u2019t give a shit!\u201d
\nAZ & JP: AHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
\n(Ren\u00e9 flashes his best devilish Mephisto grin<\/em>)<\/p>\n
\nRP: I don\u2019t know. I do snore.
\nJK: Well, you have to ask our partners. So far, I\u2019m not snoring.<\/p>\n
\nJK: Nope. I swear. It happens maybe once a year when I\u2019m really drunk, but apart from this I\u2019m not snoring. But I think that singers have the physical ability to snore louder than others, that\u2019s for sure.
\n(Ren\u00e9 starts making snoring noises<\/em>)
\nRP: Relaxing. Some people call it snoring. I call it relaxing.
\nJK: Oh yes, soft palate exercise.
\nRP: I even sing during the night. (starts humming<\/em>) I mean, not really singing, but making noises and in the morning I don\u2019t have to warm up. The first thing when I wake up I go, \u201cmmmmmmMMMMMM.\u201d\u00a0(swoops from high to low<\/em>) If this works, I know the voice is good.
\nJK: A long time ago, I had a master class and the teacher asked us, \u201cHow much time do you spend working with your voice?\u201d and they were saying an hour, ninety minutes, something like that. And I said, \u201cWhat?! I spend the entire day with it!\u201d I wake up and the first thing: \u201cIs the voice still there?\u201d (makes random noises testing the voice<\/em>).It\u2019s true.Obviously we rely on our instrument, we cannot do anything without it.<\/p>\n
\nJK: Well people say that Parma is the most difficult audience, not in a negative way, but if someone is really butchering an Italian part somewhere in the world, they would say \u201cAh\u2026 if this would happen in Parma they would probably kill him!\u201d So there must be some truth since everybody says that the audience in Parma is very critical. They applaud for everything they love and they will really crucify you if they don\u2019t like you. I\u2019ve never sung in Parma, so I cannot tell by experience, but that\u2019s what people say.\u00a0 It is true that in different countries and in different theaters, the reaction is varied. Interestingly, for instance, everyone might expect that in England the people are more reserved and more held back, but the Covent Garden audience is one of the warmest audience I know. In Zurich, on the other hand, at a theater where I sing very very often, and you get used to the amount of applause that you get, which is not much, whatever happens. And whenever a colleague comes and sings for the very first time, they would say, \u201cWas I really that bad?!\u201d And I would say, \u201cNo, you got great applause!\u201d \u201cYeah, but they stopped\u2026\u201d \u201cYes, that\u2019s just the way it is here.\u201d That\u2019s the mentality.\u00a0 So it\u2019s different everywhere, but I personally prefer an audience who are discerning \u2013 when they applaud to you hopefully they really mean it because you personally did something great on that night. And that\u2019s actually something I admire about the American audience. I know they are also very fast \u2013 they have three or four curtains and then everybody is running to get a taxi.\u00a0 But, when I appeared there for the very first time, I\u2019m certain that 99.9% of the audience had no idea about who I was and still I got a great applause I got hundreds of bravos, people were standing up and cheering at my very first performance. That is something different from many other countries where the first ingredient to get good applause is to have a name.<\/p>\n
\nRP: My proudest moment is every morning when I get up, and every single day when I go to the theater to make music and to make the people in the audience happy.\u00a0 I am always happy when I can make other people happy. And what I hope to do in the next five years is to be able to continue that; to be able to sing and to deliver music to the people.<\/p>\n